70 GTO RPO codes question
 

I'm trying to help a buddy decode some of the options on a 70 GTO he recently picked up. The codes are TDD, EWA, & AXU. Also, the PHS docs show PK2 G-78 14" w/w tires. Does anyone know if these were these the standard tire on a 70 GTO? I was expecting a standard F-70 14" like a Chevelle. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Those are the standard tires. Where are you taking those codes from?

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

The codes are on the buildsheet Don. The car is a 455 4 speed with a 3.31 Safe-T-Track 12 bolt. I've read the 12 bolt was an option on a 70 GTO? Is it possible one of these codes is for the rear? I don't know a whole lot about Pontiacs so I appreciate your help here.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

I believe that the 12 bolt came in the 455 equiped cars

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

[ QUOTE ]
The codes are on the buildsheet Don. The car is a 455 4 speed with a 3.31 Safe-T-Track 12 bolt. I've read the 12 bolt was an option on a 70 GTO? Is it possible one of these codes is for the rear? I don't know a whole lot about Pontiacs so I appreciate your help here.

[/ QUOTE ]You screwed me up a little with the way you posted the codes. EWA= ENGINE WA CODE WHICH IS A 455-370HP GTO ENGINE,AXU= AXLE [XU]331 12 BOLT POSI AND TDD =DD 4 SPEED CLOSE RATIO. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Thanks Don. Now was the 455 rated at 370 horse or 360? I've seen the engine code WA listed elsewhere as a 455 4BBL 4-speed 10:1 compression w/ 360 horse? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif Here's what we're lookin' at. A little Day 2 https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/headbang.gif
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...-Revamp001.jpg

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Nice car!

The GTO 455 engine was rated at 360 HP in 1970.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

[ QUOTE ]
Nice car!

The GTO 455 engine was rated at 360 HP in 1970.

[/ QUOTE ]LOOK IT UP AGAIN! 370 HP IN A GTO. 360 HP IN A BONNEVILLE. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

The 455 in the GTO was rated 360 HP, in the big cars (Bonneville/Grand Prix) it was rated 370 HP.

Although the engines were the same, Pontiac rated it differently for the different models, they didn't want the power to weight ratio to be too much for insurance purposes or AMA,or whatever.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Thanks guys. Like I said I don't have a ton of knowledge about Pontiacs so I appreciate your help sorting this stuff out. The car is cool...unfortunately it's not mine but a friend's. He picked it up off the original owner just a few weeks ago. It's been a local car it's entire life and came with a pile of paper, bill of sale, warranty booklet, P-O-P etc. It's a Cardinal Red w/ white "Cordova" Top & red bucket seat interior, 48XXX miles, 455 M-21 wearing mostly original paint w/ some really interesting day 2 mods. I will post more pics later. You Poncho nuts will dig it for sure.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

My buddy sent me some decent pics of the car, now that he's had a chance to get it cleaned off a little.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204793-GTONiceView.jpg
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204793-GTOHoodTach.jpg
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204793-GTOSideView.jpg
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204793-GTOFrontEnd.jpg

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Original owner cars are so cool. This one was bought off the lot late in the year, so it's options weren't "personally" ordered. The original owner didn't mind the bucket seats and console shifted 4 speed, but how do you appease a girlfriend who likes to ride close? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...kedConsole.jpg You just hacked the storage bin portion of the console off with a hacksaw, cover the remaining hump in some funky fabric, and make yourself a little upholstered crushed velvet pillow, allowing a passenger to ride right in the center next to the driver.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...SeatCusion.jpg
I'm too young to remember the days when you could get away with this kind of stuff...but I'm sure some of you aren't. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif
My buddy told me he found 2 unopened 1976 dated Trojans under the rug when he was cleaning it out too, so I guess we can safely call it a "jump seat" now. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Original owner was also a pilot in the service. He liked his gauges close by and easy to read.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...lumnGauges.jpg
Some aircraft type toggle switches too.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...leSwitches.jpg
Some more of the pretty Sun bluelines on the console.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...OSunGauges.jpg
Even a "high tech" digital clock.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...nsoleClock.jpg

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

He did keep everything though. Even the original shifter...still in the Day 2 shifter's box. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/eek.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...s/headbang.gif
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...nalShifter.jpg
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...terBoxDay2.jpg

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

He even kept the original valve covers.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...alveCovers.jpg
Even the original VIN sticker is perfectly intact.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...VINSticker.jpg
Original spare never been on the ground.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...ginalSpare.jpg
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/204...SpareFront.jpg

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Wow on the car and documents! . Seeing it's a Canadian built car, as well as the Pontiac Historical docs get the Canadian docs too....document bonanza! .

~ Pete

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Here are 2 build sheets that were found in the car. Any idea what the AXU, EWA, & TDD are in reference to? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/205258-DSC00092.JPG
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/205258-DSC00091.JPG

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

I thought we already covered that.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Oops...thanks again Don. This Pontiac stuff is a little thinking outside of the box for me. I'm still a little confused about the tires. Obviously it came with G-70 14" white stripe Firestones when it was new...as the original is in the trunk, but the PHS docs came back saying PK2 G78X14 WW Fiberglass tires. They even typed up the repro window sticker showing the $30.54 upcharge? Is this a mistranslation or something, was it simply an upcharge to specify the whitewall on a GTO, and a Tempest would have wore G-78s or is there more to it than that? The original tire pressure decal in the glovebox shows both, but appears to be a generic Tempest GTO design.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/205288-DSC00045.JPG
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/205288-DSC00051.JPG

code on spare
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/205288-DSC00049.JPG

https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/205288-DSC00108.JPG

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

This is cool too. My buddy found it under the rug when digging for the buildsheet. Canadian cars are cool. Untouched original cars are even cooler. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/205289-DSC00106.JPG

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Back then,it was a pretty common occurance for a dealer to 'switch' tires and wheels from a different car to help sell a car. This GTO(by the way a very neat car) originily had G78X14 white walls but either original purchaser requested (wide ovals G70X14)if bought from stock or this car was bought from stock and tires/wheels were already switched for an earlier sale.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Does the spare look correct for a car optioned with Rally II wheels? Do you think the spare wheel/tire in the trunk is not "factory original" to the car? It's definitely not a repro or anything like that, but maybe it's like you said, switched in while the car sat on the lot. It was not a "customer order car" it was bought new off the lot, in March of '71, so I suppose it's entirely possible some strings were pulled to make the sale.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Original bill of sale shows "W-W Tires" which leads me to believe the car wore white wall tires off the lot the day it sold. Still not sure why they'd switch G-78s out for G-70s of the same style? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/205468-DSC00085.JPG
How'd you like to buy one for 3 grand cash today? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/drool.gif
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/205468-DSC00086.JPG

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

The spare tire should definetly also be a rally II wheel if the car was ordered with them.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Thanks Don...that lends a little creedence to the notion that the entire set was likely swapped out. Any idea what the bare steel XE wheel could be from? A LeMans maybe? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

AN XE WHEEL IS THE STANDARD WHEEL FOR A 70 GTO WITH FULL HUBCAPS OR PIE PANS. https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/beers.gif I LIKE THAT CAR ALOT!!!! WISH IT WAS HERE https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Since this car was a bit of an old maid, its apparent that its Rally II's were swapped to sell some other Goat off the lot, and the switch was made. My friend just had this with a '70 Buick GS he bought from the original family. They still had the original 15x7 steel wheels, dog dishes and trim rings that they took off on "Day 2", and the 15x7 spare was still intact. But lo and behold, when we looked at the build sheet, it became apparent that the car was originally delivered with 14" chromed Buick Rallys. Obviously someone buying another GS wanted the "pretty wheels", and all five were swapped. I also once spoke to a gentleman who bought a '67 Shelby GT500 new when he was 16 (Great story), and he made them swap the KH Magstars that were on the car with the Shelby 10 spokes on the one next to it.

(By the way, the Shelby guy kept the car until just a few years ago when a guy brought him a suitcase full of money and bought the car. In hindsight, it could probably bring three of those suitcases full today, a low mile, one-owner, original paint, interior, and glass '67 GT500....)

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

That's quite feasable Tom. I'll see if my buddy can get some answers out of the original owner regarding the wheels. It is interesting that out of all the impeccable paperwork that was saved with the car, there's no original window sticker. (the one pictured is a reproduction prepared by PHS) Makes me think it may have already been gone at the time of sale, in March of '71. Maybe it was nixed to hide the wheel swap?

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

As a Pontiac guy I can say i love the car and love the paper work. i even like the love seat https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif

John

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

My buddy found 2 of these under the console. Dated 1976.
https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

[ QUOTE ]
My buddy found 2 of these under the console. Dated 1976.
https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Are you sure those aren't reproductions? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/eek.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...emlins/eek.gif https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/grin.gif

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

HOPE HE USES THEM SOON https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...ns/naughty.gif BUT IF NOT https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...-I-Have-It.gif

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Looks much better sitting on G-70 white stripes on Ralley IIs.
https://www.yenko.net/attachments/206970-GTOtires.jpg

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Available on ebay now. Cardinal Red 70 GTO 455

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

True, looks really nice with those wheels/tires.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

He used the wrong rims!! They take a 14x6. I liked it better with the slots! Also It dosnt make sense to me why he put whitewalls on it when he left all the other day 2 stuff on the car. Should have went with small lettered polys!! JMO

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

Can someone explain to me why a '70 GTO came standard with manual drum brakes and 6" wheels in 1970 when every Chevrolet performance model (SS, Z28 etc.) 1969 and after included power disc brakes as a mandatory option, as well as typically included a 7" wide wheel as part of the package?

Even if you ordered the optional Ralley II wheels on a '70 GTO they were still only 6" wide...and the GTO option didn't get you any additional braking upgrades whatsoever? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif

Why were power front discs so important to the Chevrolet division's engineers but not Pontiac's? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

[ QUOTE ]
Can someone explain to me why a '70 GTO came standard with manual drum brakes and 6" wheels in 1970 when every Chevrolet performance model (SS, Z28 etc.) 1969 and after included power disc brakes as a mandatory option, as well as typically included a 7" wide wheel as part of the package?

Even if you ordered the optional Ralley II wheels on a '70 GTO they were still only 6" wide...and the GTO option didn't get you any additional braking upgrades whatsoever? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...lins/dunno.gif

Why were power front discs so important to the Chevrolet division's engineers but not Pontiac's? https://www.yenko.net/ubbthreads/imag...mlins/hmmm.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Great question Eric! Do you think it has something to do with the 10 bolt rear in Pontiacs and 12 bolts in Chevrolets?

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

I know someone that *may* be able to answer that question...he was an engineer at Pontiac for quite a while. He worked with me this past year and has moved onto other things now...had a TON of fascinating stories to tell. Edit: Email sent!

Here's a trivia question that he posed to me...what car did the designer of the 70-73 Camaro do next? Hint...if you take the front end of the Camaro and only look at "half the front end" (pointy center of the grill to either side...it should become rather obvious.

Re: 70 GTO RPO codes question
 

[ QUOTE ]
Here's a trivia question that he posed to me...what car did the designer of the 70-73 Camaro do next? Hint...if you take the front end of the Camaro and only look at "half the front end" (pointy center of the grill to either side...it should become rather obvious.

[/ QUOTE ]

Vega?