Whereabouts of Grumpy Jenkin's Camaro Toy IV

[Carleen]

IV

[Too Many Projects]

To me, the vinyl top is still a confusing mystery. Supposedly Brooklyn had it added to match his other cars, yet the Algieri car has no VT. Which owner, after Brooklyn had it removed ? Carmen told SS John, the car was white, painted orange, supposedly the vt was added but then Carmen painted it green. Did he, then, remove the top ?? the one pic on here, the green car has no vt. Are there pics of it with a vt ? To me, this whole thing still gets lost while in BH's possession.

With the addition of Pete's pics, I believe Bill's car was a real rs. All those pics show the reverse lights in the valance. It is not just lenses screwed to the panel for appearance. The lenses mount inside the housing and removing the housing would require a filler panel over the hole for the lens to mount to. He may have changed the front valance at the time of the acid dipping, or fender change, to lose the 3-4 pounds the signal housings weighed.

I'm with RichSchmidt, without a positive vin verification, I wouldn't know which vehicle to believe to be the original T-4.
If Joe Algieri has pictures of Bill's lettering on the car he stripped, it would be conclusive that, at least, he owned the real car and the trail could lead from there.

Don't get me wrong, this is one of the most intriguing threads going and I'm sitting on the edge of my seat, hoping it can be tracked down, but there just seems to be more questions about which car to pursue as Bill's original car.

[PeteLeathersac]

Originally Posted by Carleen

This is the 1969 Toy VI

I wondered that but just too cool not to post.
Same w/ the top shot of Bill carrying the boxes which is actually the ‘67 but great pic too.

~ Pete

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[Rumbleguts396]

Really enjoying this thread. Incredible read and the pictures are awesome. Best of luck in your searches for Toy IV.

[Pro Stock John]

Mitch, I totally hear you. Maybe I'm a being a little UofC ish, but for me truth is truth until it is or isn't lol.

There were a few things that bugged me before doing any research and the vinyl top was one of them. But we have Carmen who graciously took some time out of his day yesterday to let me pepper him with some questions. I think to be fair, we need to go by his comments that they added the vinyl top. Now, Richie pointed out in a call we had yesterday that if this potential candidate for IV and if the black car he's got a line on is able to be seen at some point, one of the first things he'd look for is filled in holes where the vinyl top moldings were screwed in.

If I ever have the opportunity to meet Carmen in person, I have 5-6 other questions I would like to ask just about IV but also the '69 and some other cars too.

If any of you are buddies with him and happen to see him, please tell him thank you again from me. It's rare when older folks from that scene are comfortable and chill to share details. But I also encourage you if you see him maybe to think of key questions that have always come up about IV. One of them would just be to see if he knows anything about why the front valance is not the RS style. To me at this point it's not plausible he asked Chevy to make it that way. It's most plausible that he simple changed it around the time it got painted white. Given all the looks of III it's safe to speculate he had a lot of parts lying around the shop.

While I'm sitting here chilling out on a Sunday, I wonder about other things... What happened to the body panels Bill would have had around, did he just sell them over time or did any folks from the community buy some of them and hold onto them?

Another good question to ask Carmen and I'd love to ask him sometime in the future, what was the chassis configuration of IV when he sold it.

Another one I think would be if IV's body was acid dipped. My belief as of today is that it was not given the type of racing he was doing. Again if you guys actually know please share.

[Jeff H]

I noticed a couple of things. The Jenkins car had the rear tailpanel RS lights in all the pictures and they look to be in the correct location. The Jenkins car has the front side marker lights in some pictures and they are missing (along with lettering near the nose on the fender) in other pictures so something changed in the front end at some point. The Jenkins car has the non RS valance in all the pictures I think. The Jenkins car has the rear side marker lights in all the pictures.

The green car has no side marker lights at all or rear RS tailpanel lights and non RS valance. The white Heavy car has no side marker lights either (could they be the same car)? Could that actually be a 67 body with 68 doors?

Edit: The Algieri car has no side marker lights and no RS tailpanel lights and no RS valance but Joe said he removed the lights.

The Wild Pumpkin has side marker lights with the vinyl top. That seems more like a chance to be the IV.

The rear side marker lights might be the key unless the quarters were replaced with 67 quarters at some time when Heavy had the car.

[Pro Stock John]

Jeff, Joe Aligieri shared that he shaved the rear lights when he redid the car. I did not ask him about the marker lights in the fenders but people think he put fiberglass fenders on it.

Carmen had two Camaros and said he had a preferred green scheme, but I didn't have time to nail down more details about the other car, when it was painted, were they similar, and what happened to that car.

[Carleen]

Rotonda

[Jeff H]

Originally Posted by Pro Stock John

Jeff, Joe Aligieri shared that he shaved the rear lights when he redid the car. I did not ask him about the marker lights in the fenders but people think he put fiberglass fenders on it.

Was he referring to the rear tailpanel lights or rear side marker lights or both?

[Carleen]

Heavy