Car for Sale Misrepresentation

[Charley Lillard]

I have changed the settings in the for sale section so now after 24 hours the post can't be edited. It would have been nice to see what the ad had said.

[Don_Lightfoot]

It is unfortunate to read these circumstances regarding Danny. He and I have communicated over the years on the odd matter. I certainly cannot comment on the car since I don't recall seeing the "for sale" ad.

When I got back into the hobby in 1991 I bought a 64 GTO based on pictures only. It was a long way away in Alberta so travelling to inspect it was tough. I knew it needed a full restoration so some of the misrepresented items in the ad did not upset me too much. Also, values back then were nowhere near what they are today. I never did get back to him once I received and inspected the car. Deal was done and so be it. I restored the car and enjoyed it for a few years.

Since that time I have purchased four other Musclecars. I did personal inspections on all of them. Two of them were in Florida which was a major expense to go and see them. Each one had some issues which I learned in the inspections and others after I got them home. For me there was always things I wanted to do to the cars anyway to improve them, etc., so I didn't lose any sleep over the issues. For each of them I was happy with what I got, where I improved it and enjoyed them as well. Since I am not an investor, I was not overly worried about the money spent to improve and/or correct things as it was all about the enjoyment. At least that was my philosophy which can obviously be different than other people.

As mentioned earlier, I cannot comment on the correctness of the ad. What bothers me in today's world is a lot of manipulation in "wording" for a bunch of sale ads (not saying it was done in this circumstance). I can only imagine that every car that is sold needs something, some more than others. Hard to itemize all items in an ad. More times than not I would say these items would be disclosed and/or discussed in telephone conversations before the sale. From your standpoint it appears not all of this was done in this case.

From what you say Craig all the items can be addressed. If this is indeed the car you want then go ahead and fix them I guess (as was mentioned by another member previously). Once it's done then you will be happy and be able to enjoy it rather than dwell on the sale process itself. You are certainly frustrated at this time which I know will be hard to put behind you. I wish you luck and hopefully the car will turn out to be everything you wanted.

[budnate]

Craig, locate the best Challenger restorer in the US, ship him the car make the corrections and enjoy the car.

at this point no use fighting it, just make it right and drive it. [img]<<GRAEMLIN_URL>>/[/img]

[Mr Yenko]

Just a shame that a MAN'S word is not what it use to be worth. But I always said, that when buying 20K or 200K dollar car. Hire someone to inspect it for ya.. Don't see anything good coming out of this..BUYER BEWARE

[daleone3]

To your point Mr. Yenko, could this all be somewhat resolved and out in the open if the person that sold the car who appears to be an active member here repost the ad? It is interesting that there have been many ads posted over time by the seller but this one is curiously missing from his profile history, that being the case one has to assume that there is some interpretation of the ad that may not align with what the buyer experienced.
Everyone has there own idea of &quot;excellent&quot; or &quot;untouched&quot; or even &quot;correct&quot; so you need to be careful about that but to infer a vehicle is in excellent running condition or a clutch is performing well when it certainly appears there were top end and clutch issues, makes one wonder about how honest the portrayal of the vehicle actually was.
In this case, I hope everyone realizes that you have to assume a car needs work and you have to assume a seller is going to be less than up front about some aspect of the vehicle. Not always the case but needs to be the general belief going into any sale

[427TJ]

[RS_COPO_Canuck]

I have a Mopar or two and can suggest the following. The clutch pedal popping can be a normal thing with age - such on a survivor. If this is a totally restored car, using all new/rebuilt parts....then it should be able to be adjusted so it doesn't happen.....assuming the correct parts were used in the assembly. Ticking on the passenger side could be as simple as a heat-riser valve - check that to see if it moves correctly with no slop caused by worn bushings. May be a weak lifter not pumping up.....a pain but totally fixable. The choke? I bet the car needs a real good tune up and a proper carb rebuild. What engine? Does it match? Who checked? How about some pics so I can tell you more? Where in Canada did you buy it? I know a lot of Mopar people there - respectable ones and the ones to avoid.

[caj]

I really want to thank everyone for all of their thoughts and thank you all for taking the time to put them in words here on this board. My question about this whole thing, is it worth ruining ones reputation over a few thousand dollars or whatever the cost may be to make things right? Is it worth ones reputation to say whatever needs to be said to sell a car? My word is my word and I value my reputation. I have never sold a car on Ebay where anyone came back to me and said anything negative. If anything, I would over emphasize anything that I felt could possibly need attention. I am probably considered honest to a fault. When I was in talks with Danny about purchasing the car, he knew that about me and he seemed to be the same way. It wasn't until after he received all of his money that things started coming out....telling me about the rip in the seat and how he tucks it in at car shows to hide it. I was shocked when he told me that because there were supposed to be no further problems except for what he had told me. But what was I suppose to do at that point.

I am hoping that he will see this post and very closely think about things. I would like to see him make contact with me by phone or even on this board by private message or reply to this post. The members at the cuda-challenger board have not seen any postings by Danny to refute what I have detailed in my post there almost 2 weeks ago. I also seriously doubt that he will make an appearance to reply to this one.
I will move forward with the Challenger because I love this car. But it is hard to get anything done in this small town. That's the problem and that is what gets me upset the most. It's not like being back in Chicago where we lived before we retired and moved here to St George. Back in Chicago, you could get anything and everything done.
Charley, I think that is a great idea to not be able to modify or delete posts after a certain amount of time. I'm sure that most members that post their cars for sale here are upfront, but this can help protect people from this possibly happening again.
Again, I really do appreciate everyone's input here. You are all a great group. Maybe the input will get Danny's head out of the sand and help him in some way and get him to do the right thing. I know that he does post here a lot so lets see what happens.
Craig

[caj]

I have done research on the clutch. I received a pm from a member here saying that if a centerforce clutch is installed, you need to remove the over center spring under the dash. If you don't, the clutch will give you problems. I have contacted the owner (Ron) before Danny that did all the work on the car. He doesn't remember if a centerforce was installed, but it's a good place to start looking. Remove the over center spring under the dash may solve the problem.
The ticking is not a heat riser problem. Talking to Ron, his mechanic seemed to think it is a top end problem just like the guys that looked at it here. So I will see about getting the rocker arm shaft (one assembly on a 440 and un-adjustable) and lifters replaced.....maybe push rods too but won't know that until it's opened up.
Before purchasing the car, Danny sent me pics of the Carter carb that he said was on the car and that Ron had sent out to Scott Smith of Harms Auto (Spokane WA) to rebuild and set up. I have met Scott and he is a great guy and no one ever questions his work on carbs....he's great. I compared the pic of the carb that Danny sent me with the carb that is on the car now. NOT THE SAME CARBS!!! I questioned Danny about that and at first he denied swapping them out mentioning that I should look closer because they are the same carb. When I told him that they are not one of the same carbs because you can tell by the screw positions of the main body screws.....he quickly changed his story and said that the Carter carb that came on the car was the wrong carb and was a carb for an automatic transmission car and he swapped it out for a 4 speed manual car. Well, I have know way of knowing what is fact and fiction with Danny, but I do know that the carb needs work. I will have to get it sent out to Scott to rebuild.
I bought the car from Danny in Bolton Canada. In hind sight, I sure wish I would have asked if someone lived near there to check out the car for me. But, I didn't know anyone in the board that well and I have never done that before. I guess I also didn't want to bother anyone. I know....it's a very lame excuse when spending that kind of money but it is what it is.
The numbers are all matching. I have books and tons of documentation including the original LA broadcast sheet. I have not rechecked the VIN numbers but I plan to when we get the car on a lift. I have checked the pad numbers on the top of the engine and the date is correct and it is stamped P 440 HP and some other stuff.. I believe the engine and tranny VIN numbers are low on the passenger side. The Dana rear end is supposed to be date codes. Like I said, tons of pics with the numbers and dates with matching broach markings. I don't think that I will have any problems with anything being swapped out, but believe me, with what Danny did to me, I will check everything the first chance I get. I'll see if I can provide some pics. What are you exactly looking for?

[Fast67VelleN2O]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Charley Lillard</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have changed the settings in the for sale section so now after 24 hours the post can't be edited. It would have been nice to see what the ad had said. </div></div>

Charley, that's unfortunate since I won't be able to mark an actual ad as &quot;sold&quot;. I will have to put it in the comments and rarely does anyone read that. That and the fact that if I have to mark an old ad as &quot;sold&quot;, it will bring it back to the top knocking off newer ads on the top page to do so.