Get Ready To Plug in Or Unplug?

[Billohio]

Anyone here have a Tesla? My buddy said this week they had some glitch at Tesla and cars that were sitting at customers would not start? He didnt have the whole story but as an IT guy, he was concerned on how much Tesla could tell about what you were doing.

[ZiggyL78]

Originally Posted by 70 copo

It is not you specifically.

In order to transition to a green economy with electric car ownership the infrastructure will need to be replaced nationwide.

Average house has 100 amp service at the box. Fast charger technology requires 200 amp minimum. Once the breaker boxes are upgraded then the transmission capacity at the street and the grid becomes completely and utterly substandard.

The stated solution for the last 30 years is to press for high speed trains and other forms of mass transit to deal with the problem.

The "problem" as viewed by the planners is that people want to drive.

Maybe each home could have a gas powered generator

[EZ Nova]

Originally Posted by Lynn

"Average house has 100 amp service at the box. Fast charger technology requires 200 amp minimum. Once the breaker boxes are upgraded then the transmission capacity at the street and the grid becomes completely and utterly substandard."

I agree with the premise that we are ill suited to make the transition to ALL electric in short order. The folks pushing for all electric vehicles have not thought through how we are going to produce so much more than we have now. The transition will need to be more gradual. Personally, I believe the transition can be made easily using plug in hybrids. That is what is working for us.

Having said that, 99% of the time, the average consumer will not need to upgrade the home service. We plug Sherri's Ioinic in when we get home from work; into a regular 120 household outlet. It charges overnight. The fast charge technology NORMALLY is only needed on trips.

Here in Ontario I believe building code for the last 5 yrs 200 amps is required and about 3 yrs ago EVERY garage is prewired for a charging station in the garage right in the building code. AND each bay of the garage MUST be prewired. So 2 bay garage, 2 prewired stations. 4 car garage, 4 prewired station.

Also insurance companies are REQUIRING more power to keep your insurance valid! Back in April of 2005 I sold my house that was built in 1956. That house had been upgraded to 100 amp service. The buyer actually had 30 day after possession to upgrade to 200 amps or his insurance was getting cut off. I was in my new house for a couple months so I was allowing them to go in and do the upgrades before closing.

[EZ Nova]

YEP, just checked. This house, built in 2014 and I took possession in January 2015 has
200 AMP service.

[EZ Nova]

I'm curious about all this stuff too. Unlike Charlie, in 15 yrs I will be 69. I'm wondering when the actual BIG PUSH to EV will come in my lifetime and when gas will start getting hard to get?

Just put on offer in for the shop I rent for my cars. 15 bay industrial shop, 3 buildings with units from 700 to 1000 sq feet. 99% of the insurance companies WOULD NOT INSURE if units were rented for working on cars and have "various petroleum products". I went thru 3 brokers to get insurance. FYI there conditions are being put into new lease that will be starting January 2021.

And not so much the grid that I worry about. Here in Ontario, we actually PAY the NW USA to take our excess hydro off our hands. So that no issue here. Charging station are popping up and are around. So like gas, you can find charging stations. FUNNY, there are very few E85 pumps in Ontario. I looked 3 yrs ago and the whole province only had 3 E85 suppliers??? But charging places are popping up pretty good now.

But what about all the jobs that will be lost with EV. Gasket companies, EFI guys, mechanics, oil changes etc. Ford just signed a 2 Billion $$$ union deal here in Ontario for there plants in Oakville and Windsor. There getting EV products and due to some government agreements, to manufacture EV vehicle, you MUST also produce batteries for them in that state or province. How many supporting companies and people will be lost with the change from internal combustion to EV?????

[scuncio]

Originally Posted by Billohio

Anyone here have a Tesla? My buddy said this week they had some glitch at Tesla and cars that were sitting at customers would not start? He didnt have the whole story but as an IT guy, he was concerned on how much Tesla could tell about what you were doing.

Tesla did have a fairly well publicized IT outage last week.

[70 copo]

Originally Posted by ZiggyL78

Maybe each home could have a gas powered generator

This is not too far off the mark for the unfortunate residents of California.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...d-to-the-brink

So what is likely:

The executive order would drive up power demands in the state by as much as 9.5% over the next 10 years and 25% by 2035. Currently rolling back outs are ordered to prevent the system from collapsing during heat waves right now.

So it reasons that if everyone were to plug in their vehicles at the same time, at night, the problem could be concentrated and even worse.

Logically people would have to stagger when and how they plug in their vehicles for charging, taking into account when the state’s solar energy kicks in and when wind power peaks, for example if everyone plugs in right after work that's roughly the same time everyone also decides to turn on their air conditioning, stoves and televisions, so again at roughly the same time, solar power then dips around sunset, forcing gas plants to pick up demand.

Any way you view this it's not good.

[Lee Stewart]

California approves largest ever utility program to expand EV charging

(Reuters) - California on Thursday approved a $437 million effort to build thousands of electric vehicle chargers, its utility regulator said, calling it the nation’s largest ever utility program to expand charging infrastructure.

The money will go to utility Southern California Edison SCE_pe.A to fund the installation of nearly 40,000 chargers, the California Public Utilities Commission said in a statement.

The program will help the state achieve its goal of putting 5 million zero-emissions vehicles on the road by 2030, the CPUC said.

Half of the investment must take place in low-income communities, and 30% will be dedicated to multi-family residences, where it is more difficult to charge an EV.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN25N390

[earntaz]

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart

California approves largest ever utility program to expand EV charging



https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKBN25N390

Hmmm -- I wonder where they'll get their juice from ... it has been reported they can't keep up with what they have now .... brown outs are normal.

[scuncio]

The load sharing idea you've outlined below is the core of the 'V2G' (vehicle to grid) features and standards that are being developed between OEMs and utilities. What you didn't touch on is any vehicle with bidirectional power delivery can also feed energy back into the grid to help load-balance. I'm not suggesting this is easy or addresses all the concerns around today's grid integrity, but it helps.

Originally Posted by 70 copo

This is not too far off the mark for the unfortunate residents of California.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...d-to-the-brink

So what is likely:

The executive order would drive up power demands in the state by as much as 9.5% over the next 10 years and 25% by 2035. Currently rolling back outs are ordered to prevent the system from collapsing during heat waves right now.

So it reasons that if everyone were to plug in their vehicles at the same time, at night, the problem could be concentrated and even worse.

Logically people would have to stagger when and how they plug in their vehicles for charging, taking into account when the state’s solar energy kicks in and when wind power peaks, for example if everyone plugs in right after work that's roughly the same time everyone also decides to turn on their air conditioning, stoves and televisions, so again at roughly the same time, solar power then dips around sunset, forcing gas plants to pick up demand.

Any way you view this it's not good.